R Model side windows

[deathsled]

As an aside, nowhere in the writeup on Bring-a-Trailer does the owner say the car was "restored."  He states the car was "refurbished."

Let's look at some definitions shall we:

refurbished; refurbishing; refurbishes
Synonyms of refurbish
transitive verb

: to brighten or freshen up : renovate

res·�to·�ra·�tion ˌre-stə-ˈrā-shən
Synonyms of restoration
1
: an act of restoring or the condition of being restored: such as
a
: a bringing back to a former position or condition : reinstatement

That said, the 1987 Registry says that the car was repainted twice in Peru, once as white with red stripes and the second time, back to white with blue stripes.

Taking this a step further, the car was "refurbished" by Thoroughbred Restorations in Oklahoma, THE SHOP that restored the Ken Miles Flying Mustang 5r002.  That place strikes me as one with neurotic detail that would satisfy all of the SAAC Gods, least we forget that 5r002 sold for what was it, $3.7 million?  Allow me to supplement that the seller on Bring-a-Trailer also states that 5r213 won the 2017 SAAC MCA Mid America Triple Crown.  Can someone explain to me how that happens with side panel rivets being painted if they were supposed to be bare metal?  Just asking for a friend.  I know how neurotic the Judges are in said competitions (not castigating the behavior as I think it good to be precise) so my question is, were any points deducted for not having the rivets correct?

[tesgt350]

Not sure which book shows it (I'm not where I can get to my library at the moment), but I've seen photos of R Models under construction or parked outside at Shelby American with unpainted aluminum sail panel covers already installed on the cars. Maybe in the last book about Shelby American that Dave Friedman put out a few years ago. Based on those photos,  I believe the rivets should be painted. Hope this helps.

Dave

My thoughts as well, which is why I asked the question as I was wondering if the Panels were Painted BEFORE they were installed at SA or were they painted AFTER being installed. My guess was they were painted after install to avoid possible scratching the paint during the rivet process.   

[deathsled]

Not sure which book shows it (I'm not where I can get to my library at the moment), but I've seen photos of R Models under construction or parked outside at Shelby American with unpainted aluminum sail panel covers already installed on the cars. Maybe in the last book about Shelby American that Dave Friedman put out a few years ago. Based on those photos,  I believe the rivets should be painted. Hope this helps.

Dave

My thoughts as well, which is why I asked the question as I was wondering if the Panels were Painted BEFORE they were installed at SA or were they painted AFTER being installed. My guess was they were painted after install to avoid possible scratching the paint during the rivet process.   

More logic and reason to win the day.  It's actually a fun topic for me.  It involves investigatory skills.  Keeps us sharp and focused.

[Coralsnake]

That said, does anyone here think within a reasonable degree of certainty that a restoration of one of the rarest and most apex predators of the Shelby world would get any salient details wrong?

Yes, I have been judging cars for a long time. I never underestimate a restorers ability to screw up basic items.

With only 36 examples in existence, and most being extensively raced, I suspect there is quite a bit of freelancing going on when restoring these cars.

Amateur investigation is fine, however experience plays a critical role in ascertaining reality.

[Bob Gaines]

That said, does anyone here think within a reasonable degree of certainty that a restoration of one of the rarest and most apex predators of the Shelby world would get any salient details wrong?

Yes, I have been judging cars for a long time. I never underestimate a restorers ability to screw up basic items.

I agree. Plus the fact that there are high profile restorers that will not let their work be scrutinized after a restoration because they see themselves of not being able to make a mistake.

[deathsled]

That said, does anyone here think within a reasonable degree of certainty that a restoration of one of the rarest and most apex predators of the Shelby world would get any salient details wrong?

Yes, I have been judging cars for a long time. I never underestimate a restorers ability to screw up basic items.

With only 36 examples in existence, and most being extensively raced, I suspect there is quite a bit of freelancing going on when restoring these cars.

Amateur investigation is fine, however experience plays a critical role in ascertaining reality.

That's a reasonable point you make.

[deathsled]

OP's original question remains pending.  "I am looking for some info on the installation of the R model plexiglass side windows and frames. Do they simply bolt on to the door in the factory locations or are they welded in?"

I'd like to know myself.  Planning the same mod.

[Bob Gaines]

OP's original question remains pending.  "I am looking for some info on the installation of the R model plexiglass side windows and frames. Do they simply bolt on to the door in the factory locations or are they welded in?"

I'd like to know myself.  Planning the same mod.

They are not welded in.

[deathsled]

5R100 looks like a photo from back in the day.  It's small but if you download it and blow it up, it does not appear that the rivets are bare metal.  I do not know when this photo was taken, but judging by the racing outfit, it looks old timey.  I am all riveted by the response I may get for this one.

[deathsled]

Photo of a row of unfinished R models with unpainted sail panels installed, presumably pop riveted in place. Make of that what you will.  Unless of course, the painter hand painted them and circled around each individual rivet. Or taped off each rivet with a tiny piece of tape to preserve that shiney appearance and hit them with a spray gun.  Anything is possible. But is it probable. Case closed. Now accepting motions to reconsider.

And one more photo for demonstrative evidence.

[spiller]

Appreciate your sleuthing efforts deathsled. Wonderful! I was confused about the vent delete panels as I have seen some cars where the rivets were painted and some un-painted. Furthermore, I have seen in some cases where the panel is painted before installation (which would pertain to unpainted rivets) and some where it is installed before being painted, in which case the panel and rivets would obviously be painted over at once. Good to know this is how Shelby did it and that there are photos to prove it. However, Shelby used single stage paint. I am not sure how this look would be achieved with modern clear coat without painting the entire roof  . My build is not a restoration so I will have to work through that with my paint shop.

As for the side window frames, a facebook group has told me they require simple brackets to be made up so that they can mount in position using the existing mounting holes for the factory street car frames. I have a bunch of R model parts on their way to me and will be happy to post pictures of this detail when the parts arrive.

[tesgt350]

Photo of a row of unfinished R models with unpainted sail panels installed, presumably pop riveted in place. Make of that what you will.  Unless of course, the painter hand painted them and circled around each individual rivet. Or taped off each rivet with a tiny piece of tape to preserve that shiney appearance and hit them with a spray gun.  Anything is possible. But is it probable. Case closed. Now accepting motions to reconsider.

And one more photo for demonstrative evidence.

Is that a Chrome Bumper painted White is is it a Fiberglass Bumper?

[FL SAAC]

Photo of a row of unfinished R models with unpainted sail panels installed, presumably pop riveted in place. Make of that what you will.  Unless of course, the painter hand painted them and circled around each individual rivet. Or taped off each rivet with a tiny piece of tape to preserve that shiney appearance and hit them with a spray gun.  Anything is possible. But is it probable. Case closed. Now accepting motions to reconsider.

And one more photo for demonstrative evidence.

Is that a Chrome Bumper painted White is is it a Fiberglass Bumper?

great observation on the bumper

[deathsled]

Photo of a row of unfinished R models with unpainted sail panels installed, presumably pop riveted in place. Make of that what you will.  Unless of course, the painter hand painted them and circled around each individual rivet. Or taped off each rivet with a tiny piece of tape to preserve that shiney appearance and hit them with a spray gun.  Anything is possible. But is it probable. Case closed. Now accepting motions to reconsider.

And one more photo for demonstrative evidence.

Is that a Chrome Bumper painted White is is it a Fiberglass Bumper?

Maybe it's the fiberglass bumper of 5R002?  The side window looks like it has that pop riveted bracket that was part of the test mule aspect for the side windows.

[98SVT - was 06GT]

Installed raw and painted later. FG bumper was painted - I think 002 was the only one they tried the bumper on. The passenger window on 002 was pop riveted in place and did not go down. Jim Murietta (OVC) has the original tooling for the side windows - he was able to locate it a couple years ago. He's probably the best source for info since he was actually fabricating the cars at the time. He did all the wheel wells - 002's were bigger and the SCCA didn't like them so they were smaller on the rest. It's interesting that 002 is the only one of the first 3 to have the correct serial number tag. Those 3 cars did not get their tags until they had been finished for some time. The street car ended up with 003 and was finished first so the magazines could test it. 002 was the test mule. The 3rd car built was the production "Competition Model". It ended up with the 001 tag - it was Titus' main car and had the most wins. He also used 002 in 2 or 3 races. 5R001 was photographed for the magazines and 003 was written on the cowl in felt pen. This led to confusion and Don Day "restored" 003 to R specs believing it had been originally built as a racecar.
If you take a look at the A/FX Mustangs of Les Richey and Gas Ronda you'll see the R Model side windows. Les built the 65 GT350 drag cars for SA.