Messages

Kopec wanted Will Smith.

well that's getting jiggy with it

It's something about his ears. 

Ford with a Chevy in it eh?Another real original move.I think I need to find a vette to put a boss motor in to start "evening" things up in the universe

You mean AC with a Ford in it. 1st Coupe body was US built on English chassis next 5 were hammered out by Italians and had errors from Brock's original. Brock's current car is exactly how he wanted the originals. As far as the Chevy debate goes let's never forget that CS went to Chevy first and didn't consider Ford until GM quit taking his calls. SA has been offering the 9000 Series Coupe for some time now.

It was a ploy to get to Ioccoca. He heard Shelby was talking about Chevy's and when he heard that Carroll was talking to that Russian guy Duntov or Zuntov or WTF he called him self he told his aid, "we had better give that guy some engines before he comes around and bites us in the ass".   

Good thing to. I'd hate to see all of this aluminum turn into that crappy fiberglass toilet seat stuff GM used?   

Kopec wanted Will Smith.

It is interesting that this subject was brought up. I just got my 347 running on the stand with the Holman Moody 2x4 Boss 302 manifold and 600 Holley vacuum secondary carbs. It does not have progressive linkage. I noticed the idle mixture screws do not have much effect. It idles at about 1,000 rpm. The throttle plates do not seem like they are open too far but I did not take the carbs off and look to see how much the idle transfer slot is uncovered. Both carbs have the throttle plates open the same amount. I am not really using either one as a primary carb at this point.

I need clarification on understanding this. Are you using Boss 302 heads or Windsor heads? Again, it would be great if we could post pictures in this thread to help illustrate what is going on.

I don't know what the Holman Moody Boss manifold looks like but I do know what the SHELBY version looks like.

Your idle rpm may be more related to the camshaft that you are running? What are the Holley carb list numbers you are using?

And I thought the video was going to be about the car....disturbing

Mom, Leave me alone. I DO have a job. It is sitting in my PJ's giving my commentary on YouTube.

Have a good Friend with a 5 speed in his 67.
Saw the car Monday. He said first gear is like 4.88's!

Yes...and then some!

A DN 5 speed with a 2.80 rear is about equal to a TL (2.32) and a 3.89.

I got my Richmond when it was called a Doug Nash and it cost $800. Now I did snap off the friction welded gear selectors and went to the billet versions. After that was fixed, I broke the shift handle off. I suppose it became the weak link.

Lots of folks have been running used T-5s out of the wrecking yards. There's even a turbo T-bird version of it with a 4.11 first gear. You don't have to go the high roller route. Then you could save some money and maybe use it to get a hair cut? I've been getting hair cuts lately.

It has mixed results. Lots  of people stare? 

I'm running 3.50's in my '68 with a Richmond (Doug Nash) 5 speed. 5th is 1:1. First gear multiplication is like running a 5.00:1 rear.

I'm going to drop that to a 3.25 rear. That will be like 4.88's with a 2.20 (GM) first gear. That's still plenty for the street.

Personally I think a lot of the reason GT350's are only 14.5 second 1/4 mile cars is that they don't have enough first gear multiplication with a 2.32 first gear and only a 3.89/3.91 rear. You won't even start to get serious until you get to a 4.33 like in the factory drag pack but who wants to cruise with that set up?

Depending on the Insurance Company, he might be lucky to get out of it what he paid for it.

IMO, that is what they are going to offer him, minus the salvage.

Personally, I'd press Ford on the liability on this. The problem is going to be if ANYONE touched that car since it left Ford INCLUDING a Ford dealer.

The term "cause to effect" is going to get thrown around there. I doubt the Ford dealer would have enough liability on that as well.

The owner definitely NEEDS to get a real lawyer on this one. Louis Tulley is not going to cut it.

It all depends on what you want out of driving the car.

Theoretically you could run a 2.50:1 9" rear but as far as acceleration, forget about it.

The best combination of having your cake and eating it too would be to run something like a Richmond 5 speed with a 3.26 first gear and use a 3.25 rear ratio.

That would give you a reasonable cruising rpm, a first gear acceleration ratio of what you would put in a GM with a 2.20 first and a 4.88 rear for acceleration with the close spaced gearing of a T10.

If you want lower rpm cruising then that, then you need the 6 speed where 6th is in overdrive by about .7:1


These considerations were never possible back in the day and along with electronic fuel injection are the largest changes to the original packaging of a "current real high-performance vehicle" for the street.

I don't know how anyone is expected to be able to work on these cars.

Normally when someone here buys business insurance, you buy it as a package. I don't know of any company offering it with more then $1million in liability.

That was more then a million dollar loss. I don't think I'd even sit in it.

Plus the rate should be around 2% of the replacement value. I couldn't even afford to insure it at $30,000, a year.

I run the 2x4 Holley set up on two of my cars. One is my 67 GT500. The other is my 68 GT350 (347).
I can tell you what I do with them. Others may disagree. Power to them? 



What I do is get the engine to only idle on ONE carb. The idle throttle positions do not need to be the same on the two carbs. You want the secondary carb throttle as close to fully closed as you can get it.

There will always be some idle flow through both carbs and that includes the secondaries of each carb.

In my view you MUST use a vacuum gauge procedure to adjust the idle. The idle mixture screws do not lean the mixture. They increase or decrease the volume of atomized fuel traveling through the idle slots.

In order to be atomized, fuel must be mixed with air. Thus an air jet and a fuel jet. Those control the mixture ratio.

The a/f mixture is set by the size of the idle air restriction and the size of the idle fuel slot. Those are the "jets". You can't change that mixture ratio.

You can in fact lean the idle by closing down the idle mixture screw to about 1/2 turn, then increase the throttle screw to open a little more.

The reason that you are leaning the idle by doing that is that when you open the throttle you are idling on the mains, which have a leaner mixture then the idle circuit does.

So you are mixing down the idle mixture by using the idle throttle screw.



As far as adjusting the throttle linkage, all that matters is that you are not holding open the secondary/primary throttle with it AND that you want the secondaries to start to open at about 50% of the opening of the primary throttle AND that when the primary carb is 100% open, so is the primary throttle on the secondary carb AND you are not over centering either carb to get that relationship.

In this manner, the two carbs act like a 600 double pumper Holley with a HUGE secondary vacuum operated throttle/booster.

Since the secondaries are going to be opened by engine vacuum/load demand, they really can't flood/bog the engine.

The reason that the vacuum secondary 2x4's were taken out of the road racing cars was that the vacuum secondaries under race conditions  had the TENDENCY of not closing the secondaries fast enough.



If you notice, the carbs are mounted backwards. The main reason for that was this is a "street" set up and the primary throttles are centered in the intake as much as can be done.

Some of the small block 2x4's had the carbs mounted forward with the primary carb in the front.
Depending on who you talk to, some think (including me) that this makes a fuel distribution problem in the manifold until the secondary primaries are fully opened.

In Trans-Am racing, the cars were run virtually with WOT all the time. Trust me. If you never actually saw this in person, it more closely resembled death wish racing and everyone involved seemed to be the first one that wanted to die in combat.

If I could post, I'd offer the pile up of cars at St.Jovite as evidence.  Death wish.



My small block runs the exact same set up as the 427/428's with the carbs backwards. It simply runs fantastic that way. It's WAY different then my Webers on my Pantera and each is definitely a treat to drive. They put you in a special place and the biggest problem is you can't find a big enough, wide open enough road to drive them like you want to AND you have to go home eventually.



Also on the tuning. You have to get the automatic choke set up operating correctly before you can set up the throttle linkage. If you don't, the choke will have you on too high of a setting.

Best to try to do this with (the choke) with the engine hot. That's where you set the choke to be wide open at full operating temperature. Then you set the choke on "index".

Now bear in mind, that you CAN NOT use the universal HOLLEY choke thermostat. You MUST use the FORD thermostat. These things are marked and they have different opening rates.

The original Ford Master Parts book showed that choke thermostat for the 2x4 FE setup. My SB is using it also. It takes a while for it to fully open. About the same amount of time to heat up the oil +/-.

IF you live in a southern climate of the US, then it probably doesn't matter too much which thermostat you use BUT here in NY, when it cools off, if you use the fast thermostat (HOLLEY being the fastest) you are going to stall the engine which will set off a syndrome of pumping the carbs to start a stalled engine and as a result, you WILL wind up fouling all of the plugs.

Again, trust me on this one, YOU DO NOT WANT TO FOUL up the plugs on the FE. If you were Elvis, you'd take your gun and shoot the car...and it would deserve it too! Mutha effin hore!



OH, almost forgot, it is IMPERATIVE to get the fuel level correct. IF you were an intellectual and did your dual diligence and went to HOLLEY to get the procedure, you're in trouble. You need to drop the level about 1/8" lower then the instructions will deliver you or else, YOU WILL FLOOD with gasoline to the level you will think you hear GOD and think he is telling you this is the "great flood" and you need to build an ARK.

It seems to be related to the ethanol in the fuel? Something about it expanding when warm?



So that's my story and I'm sticking to it. I hope you can find it of some redeeming value?

Peter Brock will be showcasing the first with AMMAS/Germany at the Ring this next Friday.

http://www.fordmuscle.com/news/daytona-coupe-replicas-for-vintage-racing-fia-approved/

David Kirkham is now working on chassis #12 and #13 

I do not believe that this venture has anything to do with the Kirkhams version of the Daytona Coupe? According to the Brock released story the coupes that he is building are on digitally scanned copies of the original six. The article also said that the bodies would be hand formed, the Kirkhams use a mechanical stretching / forming method to produce their body panels. I could be wrong but I've heard nothing of any collusion between Kirkham and Brock on this project.

Collusion? Are you trying to suggest that only Russian oligarchs can afford one? That does make sense. I haven't seen any Saudi sheiks diving them.

"mechanical stretching/forming"? You mean they are stamping the panels? "Stamping them" by hand. Six guys need to come and stand on the lever handle to bend it? 

CSX2287 is the one the doctor has with the little wheel well lips pop riveted on? Lots of raw jagged sheet metal edges on that one on the doors.

Were those shocks installed on the Ford assmebly line as part of the "high performance suspension"?

Now I need to worry about catching HUB CAP ANXIETY! Great. Just great!

The seller got back to me and only gave the info off the carb tags, "the rear carb with choke C3AFBK A 7CD and the front carb no choke is C3AFBJ A 7CC".  He stated he did not want to give info off the carb air horns because he doesn't want to disturb the packaging.

    Wow ,
       If you have a car built in April , May , June , that would be an awesome addition. A Perkins territory item ! LOL Thanks for asking the dates George.
      Randy

My car qualifies. The price disqualifies it. If it is worth that kind of money, it is MUCH to valuable to unpack and use and now belongs only in a museum where it can be displayed as THE documentation of what the original induction system was.