Looking at historical printing from back in the days.
What seems to be a stock or not modified Shelby Hertz vehicle we come up with this.
Your thoughts on these "Black & Gold Bad Boys"?
2016 Ford Mustang Shelby GT-H
https://www.mustangspecs.com/2016-ford-mustang-shelby-gt-h/
Looks mighty quick.
Quote from: deathsled on October 03, 2025, 11:15:56 PMLooks mighty quick.
Hi Rich
Quick is a great adjective to use.
A stock 2016 GTH would be in the top 2 or 3 on this best of the best list.
If modified (who would do that?) it would eat their lunch and then drive away with your cool AC blowing, while listening to nice tunes.
Hope all is well
Quote from: FL SAAC on November 11, 2025, 06:15:45 PMQuote from: deathsled on October 03, 2025, 11:15:56 PMLooks mighty quick.
Hi Rich
Quick is a great adjective to use.
A stock 2016 GTH would be in the top 2 or 3 on this best of the best list.
If modified (who would do that?) it would eat their lunch and then drive away with your cool AC blowing, while listening to nice tunes.
Hope all is well
Winter is coming. You better think about putting your cars away. Oh, wait a minute.
Yep. He has to put them away so that Sunshine doesn't deteriorate the interior.
Roy
Quote from: deathsled on November 12, 2025, 11:48:22 AMQuote from: FL SAAC on November 11, 2025, 06:15:45 PMQuote from: deathsled on October 03, 2025, 11:15:56 PMLooks mighty quick.
Hi Rich
Quick is a great adjective to use.
A stock 2016 GTH would be in the top 2 or 3 on this best of the best list.
If modified (who would do that?) it would eat their lunch and then drive away with your cool AC blowing, while listening to nice tunes.
Hope all is well
Winter is coming. You better think about putting your cars away. Oh, wait a minute.
Rich, what is that snow that you mention?
All kidding aside beautiful skies and mid 70s all day today.
Now a friend sent me a picture from what he calls Hindi-ana out in the mid west of the USA
Anyone know why he calls it Hindi-ana?
Just another stripes and pipes car......
AIsez - It is important to note that the 2016 GT-H models were based on the standard 5.0L Mustang GT (with an automatic transmission), not the higher-performance Shelby GT350 model which (was built by Ford and) featured a different engine and chassis.
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on November 12, 2025, 04:40:26 PMJust another stripes and pipes car......
AIsez - It is important to note that the 2016 GT-H models were based on the standard 5.0L Mustang GT (with an automatic transmission), not the higher-performance Shelby GT350 model which (was built by Ford and) featured a different engine and chassis.
Aloha friend
Truly do understand your confusion
These GTHs just like the 65-66-67 real ones started out the same way
A standard mustang
Then recieved suspension, tuning and other special touches, just like the real ones.
Oh and that ever so importantly C.S.M. placard....priceless!
The other one you mentioned is called the SVT model
Close but no cigar, not a true SHELBY
Even Ford attempted to confuse their audience attempting to emulate the real SHELBY CSM number with their SVT version I believe they call "chassis number" or something like that
To each their own. That's what makes this the greatest country in the world.
Much love !
Quote from: FL SAAC on November 12, 2025, 05:16:34 PMClose but no cigar, not a true SHELBY
Even Ford attempted to confuse their audience attempting to emulate the real SHELBY CSM number with their SVT version I believe they call "chassis number" or something like that
To each their own. That's what makes this the greatest country in the world.
Much love !
Quote from: FL SAAC on November 12, 2025, 05:16:34 PMQuote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on November 12, 2025, 04:40:26 PMJust another stripes and pipes car......
AIsez - It is important to note that the 2016 GT-H models were based on the standard 5.0L Mustang GT (with an automatic transmission), not the higher-performance Shelby GT350 model which (was built by Ford and) featured a different engine and chassis.
Aloha friend
Truly do understand your confusion
These GTHs just like the 65-66-67 real ones started out the same way
A standard mustang
Then recieved suspension, tuning and other special touches, just like the real ones.
Oh and that ever so importantly C.S.M. placard....priceless!
The other one you mentioned is called the SVT model
Close but no cigar, not a true SHELBY
Even Ford attempted to confuse their audience attempting to emulate the real SHELBY CSM number with their SVT version I believe they call "chassis number" or something like that
To each their own. That's what makes this the greatest country in the world.
Much love !
No confusion - nor hero worship........
The "NEW" Shelby American cars built after 2005 are modified with Motorsport parts and some were even modified by SA dealers and NOT at the SA LV facility. If you look at the 65 parts you'll see the only Ford parts are the station wagon brakes, sway bar, steering arms and export brace. All the rest was socal hot rod parts. Don't blur the SVT connection - SA changes to any Ford they modify (pre title) has to get Ford's blessing. It's the same type of small group performance engineers that developed ALL of the changes to the 65 GT350 and designed the coil spring Cobra chassis. In the past CS was a true manufacturer and issued their own VIN numbers - the early cars were shipped basically as parts not a complete car with a Ford MSO. Today they are a tuning company whose HP mods must be done post title so they don't run afoul with the EPA.
As I have said in the past Ford had trouble meeting sales goals for their performance Mustangs whether they put SVO, SVT, Cobra or GT350 (all trademarks they own). The "new" GT500 was a completed project when a marketing guy thought up the idea of sticking "Shelby" on it (the one trademark they didn't own). They approached CS and he wanted $1,000 per car to use his name and likeness. Once the negotiations were done he had a 5 year 12 million personal services contract in hand. That included the modification of Mustangs at a lower level (no pre title mods that would impinge on GT500 sales). They would not release any of his old trademarks (he had been given permission earlier to use Cobra - but only on 2 seat continuation cars). So he called them Shelby GT. Having Shelby again associated with Ford and their Mustangs was a boon for sales. Their earlier late 67-70 sales connection didn't work well as people saw through that the 68-70 cars were bloated luxury Mustangs not the pinnacle of performance.
A rough timeline:
1962 - CS gets loan from Ford to buy, build, race the Cobra (said to be 5 million - with 5 year payback)
1964 - Ford wants ink for Mustang as a race car. Ford can't build it inhouse. SA removes the rear seat making it a "sports car" by SCCA definition. By the rules of the period a manufacturer could modify the suspension or engine but not both - that is why the street cars all got the modified suspension. CS is the manufacturer since any Mustang from Ford is a 4 seater.
1965/6 - Ford sees production problems and sends their engineers to help sort it out. They also assign engineers to develop the 1967 car. Realizing the suspension mods are slowing down the process those are quickly ended. Production still hasn't improved and CS loan is due in mid 67.
August 1967 - Ford assumes all the assets of SA and completes the 1967 production at the airport. Shelby gets 2 contracts. One is a 2 year race team contract to run in the TransAm series. 1968 was a disaster because Ford did not allow "Shelby Racing Company" to exercise its skills of race car preparation. They were given Kar Kraft cars and prohibited from doing any engine work. 1969 wasn't any better and at the end of his contract all the cars and spares went to Bud Moore who had a continuing contract. The second contract was for personal services. He was to be the advertising face of Ford Performance and the Shelby's
1968 - Ford opens a wholly division called Shelby Automotive to produce the 1968 Shelby's on a larger scale.
1969 - The handwriting was on the wall. The public didn't want to pay a high price for a Shelby branded luxury Mustang.
1970 - Contracts expire Shelby's ties with Ford are severed.
1984 - Ford launches a FOX body GT350 - Shelby sues gets reminded he lost trademarks in 1967. Ford grants him limited use of Cobra trademark.
2005 - CS enters into personal services contract with Ford (similar to 1967 contract). He is the face and spokesperson but has no engineering, development, manufacturing input - that is all Ford and their SVT team.
Part of that agreement allows him to modify cars and sell them as "Shelby GT's
I think Truth About Cars said it best in 1967:
The Shelby GT is a for-the-people version of 2006's Shelby GT-H, a special-edition 'Stang available only for rental through Hertz. The same upgrades apply: a one-and-a-half-inch drop, stouter springs, dampers and anti-roll bars, a front strut tower brace, and a freer-breathing intake and exhaust. There's also—wait for it— a numbered and Carroll-Shelby-signed commemorative plaque on the dash. Ooh. Aah. Sorry, just yawning.
The MSRP for this nostalgic bit of blue-oval bluster? $36,970. Seriously. And all of the performance parts are, as they say, "also sold separately." Check 'em off in your Ford Racing catalog and you'll total $2,656. Budget a couple thousand more to have everything bolted onto your $25,840 Mustang GT.
Have you driven a $6,970 commemorative plaque lately?
Yup we get it.
But it boils down to this:
The GTH is a limited edition and has a CSM tag just like the real ones 1965 through 1967
The other one is just a licensed replica with SHELBY badges that they sold as many as they could produce.
But hey is it tomatoes or tomatos?
Don't matter....we will stick with all the CSM or numbers cars.
Getting back on topic, let's take a look at performance times
GT350. GT350R. GTH GTH-SC
0 to 60. 4.3. 3.9. 4.4. N/T
1/4. 12.9. 12.5. 12.2. 11.0
Good numbers over all by each participant
Quote from: FL SAAC on November 13, 2025, 07:43:27 AM.......
The GTH is a limited edition and has a CSM tag just like the real ones 1965 through 1967
You have taken the first step to your recovery by acknowledging the "REAL ONES" were built 65-67. ALL OTHERS are FORDS whether it came from Detroit or has its final modifications in Las Vegas all have FORD VINs and were warranted through Ford dealers.
BTW The csm numbers are useless there is no reference such as a SAAC registry for these Mustangs that SA modified. BTW they were shipped as complete Mustang GTs and SA sold the take off parts. In the past SA had the clout to get Ford to assemble the chassis as they desired it.
I think it's fraudulent that SA states "manufactured" on that tag. In order for a vehicle to be manufactured by any company it needs to carry a specific 17 digit VIN as prescribed by .gov. Assembled/modified would be a more accurate descriptor.
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on November 16, 2025, 04:30:39 PMQuote from: FL SAAC on November 13, 2025, 07:43:27 AM.......
The GTH is a limited edition and has a CSM tag just like the real ones 1965 through 1967
You have taken the first step to your recovery by acknowledging the "REAL ONES" were built 65-67. ALL OTHERS are FORDS whether it came from Detroit or has its final modifications in Las Vegas all have FORD VINs and were warranted through Ford dealers.
BTW The csm numbers are useless there is no reference such as a SAAC registry for these Mustangs that SA modified. BTW they were shipped as complete Mustang GTs and SA sold the take off parts. In the past SA had the clout to get Ford to assemble the chassis as they desired it.
I think it's fraudulent that SA states "manufactured" on that tag. In order for a vehicle to be manufactured by any company it needs to carry a specific 17 digit VIN as prescribed by .gov. Assembled/modified would be a more accurate descriptor.
You might as well walk up to a window and ask it to break. We've been over this ground time and time again with this individual.
His comments are generally misleading.
Quote from: Chris Thauberger on November 16, 2025, 04:47:28 PMHis comments are generally misleading.
Yes but if we don't point it out some Newbie will believe he's an authority........
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on November 12, 2025, 09:30:38 PMQuote from: FL SAAC on November 12, 2025, 05:16:34 PMClose but no cigar, not a true SHELBY
Even Ford attempted to confuse their audience attempting to emulate the real SHELBY CSM number with their SVT version I believe they call "chassis number" or something like that
To each their own. That's what makes this the greatest country in the world.
Much love !
Quote from: FL SAAC on November 12, 2025, 05:16:34 PMQuote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on November 12, 2025, 04:40:26 PMJust another stripes and pipes car......
AIsez - It is important to note that the 2016 GT-H models were based on the standard 5.0L Mustang GT (with an automatic transmission), not the higher-performance Shelby GT350 model which (was built by Ford and) featured a different engine and chassis.
Aloha friend
Truly do understand your confusion
These GTHs just like the 65-66-67 real ones started out the same way
A standard mustang
Then recieved suspension, tuning and other special touches, just like the real ones.
Oh and that ever so importantly C.S.M. placard....priceless!
The other one you mentioned is called the SVT model
Close but no cigar, not a true SHELBY
Even Ford attempted to confuse their audience attempting to emulate the real SHELBY CSM number with their SVT version I believe they call "chassis number" or something like that
To each their own. That's what makes this the greatest country in the world.
Much love !
No confusion - nor hero worship........
The "NEW" Shelby American cars built after 2005 are modified with Motorsport parts and some were even modified by SA dealers and NOT at the SA LV facility.
[/b]
Definitely dazed and confused as everyone (well almost everyone) knows that ALL the Shelby Hertz GTHs where ALL assembled at Shelby American in Las Vegas Nevada.
ALL the GTHs
Quote from: FL SAAC on November 17, 2025, 10:51:04 PMDefinitely dazed and confused as everyone (well almost everyone) knows that ALL the Shelby Hertz GTHs where ALL assembled at Shelby American in Las Vegas Nevada.
Assembled - NOT MANUFACTURED from a pile of parts but modified with Ford Motorsport parts and Shelby specific parts.
It's a modified Mustang GT that Ford assembled and SOLD TO HERTZ then shipped to HERTZ in Las Vegas for modifications by SA in Las Vegas. Look at the window sticker for more info.
Here is a MSO T82 indicates 2006 GT-H. The window sticker is hard to read but Hertz is the dealer and the car was shipped to Hertz LV. Once they went through modifications Hertz got them back (they could ship cheaper than what Ford wanted to charge them).
Basically what it all boils down is the Hertz cars were purchased as complete cars from Ford and then Hertz contracted with SA to modify them. There is a list of what Shelby Automotive Inc (NOT Shelby American) charged for the mods. Ford even refunded about 3 grand of the cost to Hertz per car.
For the Shelby GT they got a deal to drop ship the cars to LV where SA did the mods then shipped them to dealers. But again Ford VIN & MSO series/model T8? designating FORD MUSTANG GT 2 door coupe (or convert).